Tax Credits for New Jobs, but Really for Union Busting?

[ABFwife]

This is really upsetting. The trend is just getting worse IMO

A California-based company called VWR is busting its union, moving work to a non-union workforce a few hours away and receiving both federal and state tax incentives to do it. The scandal is yet another example of how companies can game the tax systems while hurting workers, and the government does little to stop them.

In Brisbane, Calif., 183 workers, members of Teamsters Local 853 that work at VWR, will lose their jobs at the end of the year when their scientific chemical warehouse closes. VWR, which is owned by Chicago-based private equity firm Madison Dearborn Partners, is moving the warehouse 230 miles away to Visalia, Calif. At the warehouse in Visalia, workers will be non-union and are expected to make half of what the current workers in Brisbane earn, according to the Teamsters.

Tax Credits for New Jobs, but Really for Union Busting? - Working In These Times

[ABFHOG]

Actually it is creating jobs. It's creating new jobs Visalia doesn't have right now. And with the the tax incentives, it could allow this company to probably expand and create more jobs once in Visalia.

This is further proof, that corporations won't stick around pay high taxes. They will move to more tax favorable locations.

[222lifer]

Union jobs in Brisbane eliminated. Non union jobs in Visalia created. Looks to me like a transfer of jobs to bust the Union.

Where are the non relocation laws to prevent this? Just another case of corporate America's penchant for screwing their work force and busting Unions.

"Creating", more jobs would be a wonderful thing had they been on the same scale as the ones "transfered." Where did the middle class go? Why is the economy stagnant? Replace high paying jobs with disposable income to low paying jobs that barely provide neccessities? What a brillliant formula for spurring the economy.

Further proof that corporate America has one thing in mind. They will get theirs while they destroy what is left of this great nation and the middle class.

[ABFHOG]

Union jobs in Brisbane eliminated. Non union jobs in Visalia created. Looks to me like a transfer of jobs to bust the Union.

Where are the non relocation laws to prevent this? Just another case of corporate America's penchant for screwing their work force and busting Unions.

"Creating", more jobs would be a wonderful thing had they been on the same scale as the ones "transfered." Where did the middle class go? Why is the economy stagnant? Replace high paying jobs with disposable income to low paying jobs that barely provide neccessities? What a brillliant formula for spurring the economy.

Further proof that corporate America has one thing in mind. They will get theirs while they destroy what is left of this great nation and the middle class.

Non relocation laws? This is America. A business can choose to operate their business where ever they want.

Why doesn't Brisbane offer some tax incentives to this business?

The economy is stagnant because business still doesn't know what their tax liabilities will be after December. Also they know Obamacare will be increasing the cost of business. Why hire now, if they have to layoff in 6 months?

[222lifer]

Non relocation laws? This is America. A business can choose to operate their business where ever they want.

I agree with Rome Aloise on this. It is nothing more than an abuse of Federal and State funds to bust Unions. Corporate sight of hand.

Why doesn't Brisbane offer some tax incentives to this business?

That would be where the "Faliure to bargain in good faith comments come into play." Were viable options explored? Not according to the article.

The economy is stagnant because business still doesn't know what their tax liabilities will be after December. Also they know Obamacare will be increasing the cost of business. Why hire now, if they have to layoff in 6 months?

I am left to assume you don't agree that low wages with no disposable income do not have a stagnating effect on the economy? Do you surmise that after December those high paying union jobs transferred from Brisbane to low wage jobs in Visalia will somehow miraculously create disposable income?

[ABFHOG]

I agree with Rome Aloise on this. It is nothing more than an abuse of Federal and State funds to bust Unions. Corporate sight of hand.



That would be where the "Faliure to bargain in good faith comments come into play." Were viable options explored? Not according to the article.



I am left to assume you don't agree that low wages with no disposable income do not have a stagnating effect on the economy? Do you surmise that after December those high paying union jobs transferred from Brisbane to low wage jobs in Visalia will somehow miraculously create disposable income?

Offering tax incentives is abuse state and federal funds?
Why can't this union bargain in Visalia?

Cost of living on Visalia is a lot cheaper than San Fransisco. Even with lower wages, disposable income us very achievable. But of course this always depends on the employees personal budget.
I work with guys making 80k, and are flat broke.

[222lifer]

Offering tax incentives is abuse state and federal funds?

I assumed you had read the article. The "formula" as stated in the article is an abuse. I agree with them. Legal. Unethical.

Why can't this union bargain in Visalia?

A different local I'm sure. The local in Brisbane got screwed. The company will give each of the new employees their "orientation." The Union took several steps back.

Cost of living on Visalia is a lot cheaper than San Fransisco. Even with lower wages, disposable income us very achievable. But of course this always depends on the employees personal budget.

Thanks for those words of advice Mr. Ramsey. Here is your crust of bread, now find a way to feed a family of twelve with it? You must have a short memory HOG or you walked right into a high paying job as a youngster. Been there on the low end of the scale. I did have disposable income. However, I did not have much of it. I could afford to eat out once a month and see a movie. I am on the higher end now. I have lots of disposable income. We want for very little. We also have several avenues of retirement income. Those on the lower end of the wage scale do not. Kind of tough to fund that awesome (not) 401k when they need to eat. Sorry, but Wall Street and the economy will take a back seat in the low wage household.

I work with guys making 80k, and are flat broke.

You are going to use individuals with weak constitutions to support a business that is considered a Union buster? By flat broke you mean they mis-used their disposable income? They were caught up in a credit trap? I would venture to guess they had loads of disposable income at one time. Trouble is for some reason they felt the need to keep up with the Jones's. Look at the bright side HOG, at least they are keeping your banking friends happy. All that credit interest!

[ABFHOG]

I assumed you had read the article. The "formula" as stated in the article is an abuse. I agree with them. Legal. Unethical.



A different local I'm sure. The local in Brisbane got screwed. The company will give each of the new employees their "orientation." The Union took several steps back.



Thanks for those words of advice Mr. Ramsey. Here is your crust of bread, now find a way to feed a family of twelve with it? You must have a short memory HOG or you walked right into a high paying job as a youngster. Been there on the low end of the scale. I did have disposable income. However, I did not have much of it. I could afford to eat out once a month and see a movie. I am on the higher end now. I have lots of disposable income. We want for for very little. We also have several avenues of retirement income. Those on the lower end of the wage scale do not. Kind of tough to fund that awesome (not) 401k when they need to eat. Sorry, but Wall Street and the economy will take a back seat in the low wage household.



You are going to use individuals with weak constitutions to support a business that is considered a Union buster? By flat broke you mean they mis-used their disposable income? They were caught up in a credit trap? I would venture to guess they had loads of disposable income at one time. Trouble is for some reason they felt the need to keep up with the Jones's. Look at the bright side HOG, at least they are keeping your banking friends happy. All that credit interest!

So a company can't move for their self interest? They can't take advantage of a tax incentive offered to them?

Family of 12! LOL. Gotta come up with an extreme situation to prove you're point?
You brought up disposable income. It's fair when talking about disposable income you have to take in account cost of living and personal habits.

And Dave Ramsey is the MAN!!!! A true man of the people. A man that really cares about this country and others.

Ya, I never had it rough. Straight from HS to a union job...,,NOT!!!


You seem a little testy. Still recovering from Walker?

[222lifer]

So a company can't move for their self interest? They can't take advantage of a tax incentive offered to them?

Like I said, I guess you didn't read the article and apparently you didn't read my reply either?

Family of 12! LOL. Gotta come up with an extreme situation to prove you're point? You brought up disposable income. It's fair when talking about disposable income you have to take in account cost of living and personal habits.

Family of 6, family of 12, it really doesn't matter. Those jobs will not provide much in the way of disposable income. Low end wages don't provide for much other than the basic necessities. There is little disposable income with those jobs. I guess those folks should live like paupers? They wouldn't need to if those jobs that were transferred carried the same Union wages and bennies.

And Dave Ramsey is the MAN!!!! A true man of the people. A man that really cares about this country and others.

He has some great ideas for people that have a hard time with their finances. People that just couldn't say no to credit cards. Bad decisions with real estate, etc. But even he would be scratching his head when it came to the limited budgets these wages create. Remember, those Union wages that went away when the jobs were transferred more than likely had a great benefits package negotiated with the wages. Those benefits will now need to be acquired from the meager income received. In other words they will more than likely do without.

Ya, I never had it rough. Straight from HS to a union job...,,NOT!!!

Given the age and lengthy career had between Roadway Express and ABF you claimed on another site, I do believe you had it easier than most. If I remember correctly you stated also that you were pulling down around 150k with two incomes. You had trouble with your finances and required Dave Ramsey's assistance. Damn man. Cut up the plastic and rein those spending habits in a little. There, that didn't cost you a penny. My treat. Ask Ramsey for a refund. Another conservative moment from a (not) liberal lefty.

[ABFHOG]

Like I said, I guess you didn't read the article and apparently you didn't read my reply either?

I read it. It's obviously a spin job.

Family of 6, family of 12, it really doesn't matter. Those jobs will not provide much in the way of disposable income. Low end wages don't provide for much other than the basic necessities. There is little disposable income with those jobs. I guess those folks should live like paupers? They wouldn't need to if those jobs that were transferred carried the same Union wages and bennies.

It's all relative. That local better busy.

He has some great ideas for people that have a hard time with their finances. People that just couldn't say no to credit cards. Bad decisions with real estate, etc. But even he would be scratching his head when it came to the limited budgets these wages create. Remember, those Union wages that went away when the jobs were transferred more than likely had a great benefits package negotiated with the wages. Those benefits will now need to be acquired from the meager income received. In other words they will more than likely do without.

How meager? Hell, what I make at ABF won't go that far in San Francisco.

Given the age and lengthy career had between Roadway Express and ABF you claimed on another site, I do believe you had it easier than most. If I remember correctly you stated also that you were pulling down around 150k with two incomes. You had trouble with your finances and required Dave Ramsey's assistance. Damn man. Cut up the plastic and rein those spending habits in a little. There, that didn't cost you a penny. My treat. Ask Ramsey for a refund. Another conservative moment from a (not) liberal lefty.

Again, why make this about me? Are you obsessed with me?

Sure my wife and I making 140 to 150, but only within the last 3 or 4 years. Has many many years if struggles. Even at Big R, had to barrow from my dad to pay the rent. Not because of debt, but because of no work. And wife hadn't finished nursing school yet.

Did I collect some debt? Sure, but my wife and I learned our lesson, paid everything off except for a couple small car payments. Doing fine now. Thanks DAVE!!

Now, you want my blood type, Social Security number?